not kidding and not wrong

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Posted by:

Frank

on May 29, 2005 at 01:19:21:

Gecko, please don't tell me after all these years on custody message boards, you still don't know what custody is. Outside of marriage, neither parent is presumed to have custody. Unless married, custody exists when a judge says it does. And not until. Your false information could lead this woman to believe that she doesn't have to file for custody. Many mothers make that mistake and are amazed when they find out they have never had custody.

"There is NO “technical standpoint”, there is simply the LAW."

Obviously that is exactly what I meant by "technical standpoint". According to the LAW, she does not have custody.

"Actually…marital status has a great deal of bearing in matters of 'custody'."

Yes, but not in the way you are presenting it.

"If a woman is single at the time of birth, she has de jure “custody since she is the ONLY “legal” parent until such time as paternity is established…either through a “voluntary acknowledgement” or through a court order. And the establishment of paternity does not automatically confer any “rights”."

The establishment of MATERNITY does not confer any more "rights" than paternity does. PLEASE understand that, if you understand nothing else. Why is it sooo hard for people to understand the concept of equality?

IF this were to end up in court and IF the mother lies about the fatherhood, the father can get a paternity test ordered by the court. This does not mean that the mother has any more "rights" to the child than the father.

I see random quotation marks all over the above except from your post. Are you actually quoting any official law, since you claim to be speaking the law?

If no custody is established, either parent has the right to take their child anywhere they wish. Until custody is ordered by the court, neither parent has legal custody.

Marriage and parenthood are not interchangeable terms. Parenthood means that you are the parent of a child, marriage or not.

"If the woman is married at the time of birth, her husband is presumed to be the biological father and through the civil act of their marriage, is accorded the same legal “custodial” rights as the mother."

This is all completely false. If the biological father is not the spouse of the mother, the name on the BC should be the ACTUAL father. The spouse of the mother does not have some sort of automatic "custodial rights" as you call them. Sure, a mother could probably try to falsely claim that her H is the father, but that can be contested and the true father can get custody. This is no different than with any stepparent.

(In your response to my statement about the bio father's name being on the BC) "First of all, you’re going to have to show me the law or statute that says this."

No, I am not going to have to show you either the law or statute. I don't have a law library at my fingertips, thanks, and this wouldn't be worth it if I did. It is a criminal offense to knowingly falsify birth certificates, as well as social security or any other official documents. I do remember that the statute number is posted at the county admin building where you get the BC, and at the federal building where you get the SS card.

"Second, it’s not always up to the mother."

Quite true. I am the one who procured my children's birth certificates and had I been inclined to lie, it would have been me that was in violation of the law.

"If the woman is married, the ONLY name that goes on the BC is the husband’s since he is presumed to be the father."

False. If he is not the father, the biological mother and father are the names that go where it asks who the mother and father are. This is extremely important when medical issues arise and true genetic lineage needs to be on record.

"If the woman is married and states that her husband is NOT the “father”, then it is left blank."

Is this the world according to Gecko??? If you know who the father is, that is the name that goes in the blank! Why would you leave it blank unless you don't know who the father is?

"If the woman is single, then the only way the “father’s name” is placed on the BC at the time of birth is if the “father” signs an “acknowledgment of paternity”."

Very creative, but it has no bearing on truth. This just doesn't happen. Is this supposed to be some sort of form you fill out? There already is an "acknowledgment of paternity". It is called a birth certificate. It is an official record of who the true parents are, among other vital statistics. They don't even ASK if you are married. They ask two questions: Who is the mother and who is the father?

Why do you put the word "father" in quotes here?

"Otherwise, the “father” has to go to court to establish paternity and with a court order, have the BC changed."

The only thing that is different about a father or a mother getting a BC is that they would KNOW I was lying if I left the mother's name blank.

If two people are each claiming that the other person is not the true parent, then the police can't simply assume which one is telling the truth. Both parents would have to prove parenthood so it isn't as if fathers are legally presumed to be the liars. What if they took a child from a father and handed her to a woman who claimed to be the mother, but was not? If either parent lies about parentage, it will need to be proven, not just the father.

"If the mother and father are NOT married, then the mother does have the “right”, unless otherwise decided in a court of law."

Absolutely false. If some state tried to make this a law, it would be shot down before the ink dried as blatant gender bias. Can't happen.




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